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THE PAIN OF LOVE & THE POWER OF GRACE

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Forum Name: VOICE OF PROPHECY - Prophetic Words
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URL: http://archive.openheaven.com/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=26757
Printed Date: 01/17/2017 at 11:57am


Topic: THE PAIN OF LOVE & THE POWER OF GRACE

Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Subject: THE PAIN OF LOVE & THE POWER OF GRACE
Date Posted: 03/17/2009 at 2:56pm

The Pain of Love & The Power of Grace
By Ron McGatlin
Inner pain has a way of reducing us from our self-elevated place of reliance upon our independent, self-promoting tendency toward haughtiness. Inner emotional pain from rejection, loss, or lack of respect among peers and loved ones can be a great blessing to our lives as it tends to bring down all our self-made castles of self-sufficiency. Failure of our self-promotional enterprises can bring us to utter dependence on our Savior, Lord and King to lean our soul into the comfort and rest in His pure sweet love. Soon our hearts are melted and our strength turned to weakness as His strength gently flows into our souls. Thus the progressive death of our self-life is making room for His holy pure life of love and power to fill the place vacated by our demise.
2 Cor 12:9: And He said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness." Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
In a very real sense, our sorrow is turned into joy, His joy. We enter greater peace and rest in the warmth of His love, glory abounds within and flows the joy of the Lord outwardly in strength to a needy world around us. Through the sorrow of the pain of the loss of our self-focused ambitions, we become fountains of living water flowing into the dry lands of our brothers and sisters. We become lights of love and joy in the deep darkness of a world of people who have gone astray from the God who formed them. The love of God is the primary ministry of His sent ones sent into this life to suffer for righteousness sake, imparting the kingdom of God and His righteousness into the world.
1 Pet 4:12: Beloved, do not think it strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened to you; but rejoice to the extent that you partake of Christ's sufferings, that when His glory is revealed, you may also be glad with exceeding joy. If you are reproached for the name of Christ, blessed are you, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. On their part He is blasphemed, but on your part He is glorified.
Jesus did not come to build our kingdoms.
The comforter did not come to encourage and sustain us in our pursuit of other gods and self-reliant building of our kingdoms of pleasure-seeking and the love of money and the things it will buy. Our pride in our abilities and cunning works of competitive accomplishments will be broken to pieces and dissolved before we truly enter the kingdom of heaven lifestyle. The fall of our personal and corporate Babylon is part of the death beyond which we enter the resurrection life of Christ Jesus filling our spirit, soul, and body with His supernatural life of love and power from heaven.
Father, we thank you for the pain of death that leads to resurrection life, filling us with the glorious reality of Christ’s life of pure holy love. We receive your progressive holiness clearing the land of our hearts from darkness part by part until there remains no place for the darkness of the enemy. From the inner core of our spirit to the extremities of our soul and body let your holiness progressively occupy until we are pure and holy as You are holy. Thank You, Father, that we are not trapped in sin and can truly live and walk by the Spirit in Christ with Christ fully living in our earthly bodies in holiness. Thank You for the pain of death that produces progressive holiness filling every cell of our body and every moment and movement of our lives. Amen
Man’s godless kingdoms are falling.
Our pride-filled shrines of religious doctrines designed to demonstrate our human wisdom and knowledge by dissecting and explaining our human perspectives of infinite God are crumbling. Our castles built upon human principles and concepts taken from the wisdom of God but stripped of the life and Spirit of God are imploding upon their shifting foundations of sand.
Human government based upon the earthly wisdom of man was never a suitable and workable governance for the nations of the world. Throughout history all governments have failed and all-powerful nations have crumbled. Every form and type of government has failed and democracy without God is doing the same. Even as we watch in this day, the world’s governments are failing. Powerful spirits have infiltrated and are subversively devouring the carcasses of dead religion and godless secularism that were fueled by the gods of greed and self-indulgent pleasure seeking. The wealth and prosperity of the land is being devoured as the great harlot of Babylon is burning and her smoke arising to heaven.
Holiness unto God is advancing.
The land is being cleared as the progressive holiness of the kingdom of God is being formed in pure-hearted people of God who have no respect for the past ways of Babylonian practice. This is a people who through painful death have come to resurrection life in Christ Jesus and despise their past lives in Babylon. They will not tolerate any longer the devious beliefs that sin must continue in their mortal bodies mixed with the grace of God.
They are grasping the great principle that grace is not now and never was a covering for continued existence of sin and immoral ways in their lives. Grace is not a whitewash that causes God to be blinded to the evil in the hearts of man. Grace is the influence of God on the heart overcoming sin. Jesus did not die on the cross to make it acceptable for us to continue to live with sin in our hearts. Jesus died and rose again to abide in His people by the Holy Spirit to destroy sin and all the works of the devil. Grace is the powerful influence of God to live holy now in this life apart from sin. Grace is the work of God to completely cleanse us and empower us to live holy lives as He is holy. The Greek word translated grace is “charis.”
charis, khar'-ece; from G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstr. or concr.; lit., fig. or spiritual; espec. the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude).
The grace of God is appropriated by faith. The works of grace are released by faith. If we believe, grace will work to purify our hearts from sin that Christ Jesus can fully live in us doing the same works and greater works than He did on earth in His natural human body. True faith in God does not exist without producing works of the grace of God in the heart and life of the believer.
James 2:18-20: But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works. You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe; and tremble! But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
Perhaps the greatest aspect of the grace of God is the indwelling Christ totally influencing our hearts and reflecting out in our lives. Yes, it is the work of God and something that no natural man can do, but it is not a covering for sin. It is the gift of power to annihilate sin and set us free to live holy lives in this world. The mercy of God forgives our sin through the cross. The grace of God destroys our sinful ways by the resurrection life of Christ empowering us to live pure and holy lives as Christ lives in us.
Rom 5:10: For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (His life in us.)
2 Cor 4:11: For we who live are always delivered to death for Jesus' sake, that the life of Jesus also may be manifested in our mortal flesh.
Completed salvation by grace through faith includes cleansing from sin as well as forgiveness of sin.
Titus 2:11-14: For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing (manifestation) of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works.
The destruction of Babylon is related to the arising of God’s holy people.
Holy people empowered in the grace of God are the catalyst for the progressive cleansing of the land. They are the sons (male and female) that are beginning to demonstrate the kingdom of heaven on earth. As the number of holy sons increases in the earth, God will cleanse the land before them. God will progressively cleanse the land as the holy people of God are prepared to occupy the land.
 
The fire of God will cleanse the land of all evil ways and works, the very rudiments of the wicked along with all they have done or built by their lust, greed, sorcery, evil strife, carousing, rebellion, and unloving ways, will be totally dissipated and burned. Their evil works and power will be dissolved by the fire of God's love through repentance and receiving the grace of God or by the fire of God in judgment.
 
Joel 2:3: A fire devours before them, And behind them a flame burns; The land is like the Garden of Eden before them, And behind them a desolate wilderness; Surely nothing shall escape them.
 
Psa 97:3: A fire goes before Him, And burns up His enemies round about.
 
Beauty For Ashes
The kingdom of God will arise from the ashes of destruction. The remnant of holy New-Jerusalem Bride people will occupy, heal, and restore the earth in the glory of God.
Isa 61:1: "The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon Me, Because the LORD has anointed Me To preach good tidings to the poor; He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim liberty to the captives, And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
Isa 61:2: To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, And the day of vengeance of our God; To comfort all who mourn,
Isa 61:3: To console those who mourn in Zion, To give them beauty for ashes, The oil of joy for mourning, The garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; That they may be called trees of righteousness, The planting of the LORD, that He may be glorified."
Isa 61:4: And they shall rebuild the old ruins, They shall raise up the former desolations, And they shall repair the ruined cities, The desolations of many generations.
The progressive holiness of God is moving and this whole thing may be much bigger than we have even imagined in the past. Christ in you (His pure and holy people) is the hope of glory and is very practical and real in this life now.
Isa 9:7: Of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end, Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom, To order it and establish it with judgment and justice From that time forward, even forever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
Your kingdom come. Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. (Mat 6:10)
Keep on pursuing love. It never fails
and His kingdom never ends.

Ron McGatlin

http://archive.openheaven.com/" target=_blank eudora="autourl - archive.openheaven.com
mailto:basileia@earthlink.net - basileia@earthlink.net


Replies:

Posted By: Julie Gilbert
Date Posted: 03/17/2009 at 4:58pm

'Titus 2:11-14: For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing (manifestation) of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from EVERY lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works.'

Amen Ron... may we all press in to the Lord in this time and allow is refining fire to work in us the death of ourselves that HIS resurrected life might rise up and affect the whole world!!

Thank you Jesus for redeeming us from EVERY lawless deed and for purifying your Bride for the days in which we live. The enemy IS DEFEATED and the Kingdom of God is at hand! Within each of us YOUR KINGDOM resides... Yes Lord, Let your Kingdom come and YOUR WILL be done in us upon this earth as it is in heaven!!


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See, the former things have taken place, and new things I declare; before they spring into being I announce them to you. Forget the former things; do not dwell on the past. See I am doing a new thing



Posted By: Bojo Sun
Date Posted: 03/17/2009 at 5:29pm

Thank you, Lord, for your truth and direction!

Brother Ron, may the Lord bless you!




Posted By: Kathy Bippus
Date Posted: 03/17/2009 at 7:19pm

amen amen amen! bless your heart Ron

 Praise God for pure holy truth coming forth here

~To the only wise God our Saviour be Glory, Majesty, Dominion and Power both now and forever. amen ~

 

 



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In His Love








Posted By: Mandy Gay
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 2:54am

Amen, amen, amen! 

Thank you Ron for persisting in bringing the truth of the kingdom. 

Love Mandy




Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 6:28am

'Titus 2:11-14For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing (manifestation) of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave Himself for us, that HE might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for himself His own special people, zealous for good works.

Notice it's Grace we preach and grace teaches us ,

we are not called to fight sin but to fight the good fight of faith

grace......zach



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Great Grace



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 8:00am

Zach, Yes, grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lust a place in our hearts. Yes, through faith grace is released to cleanse us from sin in the heart which destroys sinful deeds in our lives. We are progressively becoming holy in our walk and do not continue in sin. It is all a work of Christ in us as a gift through faith (believing).  It is the influence of Christ in us cleansing and living His holy resurrection life. "We are saved" means more than born again. It means delivered from sinning, protected, healed, doing well and made whole.

The Greek word translated saved is "sozo":

4982. sozo, sode'-zo; from a prim.  sos (contr. for obsol.  saos, "safe"); to save, i.e. deliver or protect (lit. or fig.):--heal, preserve, save (self), do well, be (make) whole.

Grace is the work of faith to bring forth holy living, the salvation of spirit, soul and-body, the kingdom of God lifestyle.

1 Cor 6:9  Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
1 Cor 6:10  nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
1 Cor 6:11  And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

1 Cor 15:33  Do not be deceived: "Evil company corrupts good habits."

Gal 6:7 
Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.

James 1:14 
But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed.
James 1:15 
Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
James 1:16 
Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
James 1:17  Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and comes down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shadow of turning.

Keep on pursuing love. It never fails
and His kingdom never ends.

Ron McGatlin

http://archive.openheaven.com/" target=_blank eudora="autourl - archive.openheaven.com
mailto:basileia@earthlink.net - basileia@earthlink.net




Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 3:20pm

Thanks Bojo, Kathy and Mandy for your Amens.

Holiness unto God is advancing.
The land is being cleared as the progressive holiness of the kingdom of God is being formed in pure-hearted people of God who have no respect for the past ways of Babylonian practice. This is a people who through painful death have come to resurrection life in Christ Jesus and despise their past lives in Babylon. They will not tolerate any longer the devious beliefs that sin must continue in their mortal bodies mixed with the grace of God.
They are grasping the great principle that grace is not now and never was a covering for continued existence of sin and immoral ways in their lives. Grace is not a whitewash that causes God to be blinded to the evil in the hearts of man. Grace is the influence of God on the heart overcoming sin. Jesus did not die on the cross to make it acceptable for us to continue to live with sin in our hearts. Jesus died and rose again to abide in His people by the Holy Spirit to destroy sin and all the works of the devil. Grace is the powerful influence of God to live holy now in this life apart from sin. Grace is the work of God to completely cleanse us and empower us to live holy lives as He is holy. The Greek word translated grace is “charis.”
charis, khar'-ece; from G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstr. or concr.; lit., fig. or spiritual; espec. the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude).
The grace of God is appropriated by faith. The works of grace are released by faith. If we believe, grace will work to purify our hearts from sin that Christ Jesus can fully live in us doing the same works and greater works than He did on earth in His natural human body. True faith in God does not exist without producing works of the grace of God in the heart and life of the believer.
James 2:18-20: But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works. You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe; and tremble! But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
Perhaps the greatest aspect of the grace of God is the indwelling Christ totally influencing our hearts and reflecting out in our lives. Yes, it is the work of God and something that no natural man can do, but it is not a covering for sin. It is the gift of power to annihilate sin and set us free to live holy lives in this world. The mercy of God forgives our sin through the cross. The grace of God destroys our sinful ways by the resurrection life of Christ empowering us to live pure and holy lives as Christ lives in us.
Rom 5:10: For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (His life in us.)
2 Cor 4:11: For we who live are always delivered to death for Jesus' sake, that the life of Jesus also may be manifested in our mortal flesh.
Completed salvation by grace through faith includes cleansing from sin as well as forgiveness of sin.
Ron



Posted By: Bojo Sun
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 6:38pm

"The grace of God is appropriated by faith."

Amen to this critical and practical understanding of how the grace of God works unto us...The Blood, the Wisdom, the Glory, consquently the Life all have to be appropraited thought our faith and obedience...

Glory to God!

Thank, brother Ron, for sharing the truth of God with such simplicity...

Sun

 

 

 




Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 7:32pm

But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us . . . sanctification . . . —1 Corinthians 1:30

The Life Side. The mystery of sanctification is that the perfect qualities of Jesus Christ are imparted as a gift to me, not gradually, but instantly once I enter by faith into the realization that He "became for [me] . . . sanctification . . . ." Sanctification means nothing less than the holiness of Jesus becoming mine and being exhibited in my life.

The most wonderful secret of living a holy life does not lie in imitating Jesus, but in letting the perfect qualities of Jesus exhibit themselves in my human flesh. Sanctification is "Christ in you . . ." ( Colossians 1:27 ). It is His wonderful life that is imparted to me in sanctification— imparted by faith as a sovereign gift of God’s grace. Am I willing for God to make sanctification as real in me as it is in His Word?

Sanctification means the impartation of the holy qualities of Jesus Christ to me. It is the gift of His patience, love, holiness, faith, purity, and godliness that is exhibited in and through every sanctified soul. Sanctification is not drawing from Jesus the power to be holy— it is drawing from Jesus the very holiness that was exhibited in Him, and that He now exhibits in me. Sanctification is an impartation, not an imitation. Imitation is something altogether different. The perfection of everything is in Jesus Christ, and the mystery of sanctification is that all the perfect qualities of Jesus are at my disposal. Consequently, I slowly but surely begin to live a life of inexpressible order, soundness, and holiness— ". . . kept by the power of God . . ." ( 1 Peter 1:5  ).




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Great Grace



Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/18/2009 at 9:41pm

FOR THE RECORD

                  IAM AN EXPERIENCE SEEKER!

                      JESUS IS THE EXPERIENCE

FOR THE RECORD

                THE WORD OF GOD IS A PERSON!

FOR THE RECORD

                GOD IS MY FATHER AND I AM HIS SON

What kind of Father never allows His kids to feel and experience His hugs and kisses?

Can you imagine a Father having a Kingdom and it's like paradise, filled with undescribable glory , but He will not allow his kids to experience it.

Jesus says" that where Iam you may also be."

not some day bye and bye, but now in this life time we can come literally to the throne of God, through the blood of the Lamb.

We are called to have literal face to face intamacy with Christ through the New covenant

When you hang out with someone, when you are intimate with them, you know what they smell like, what they like and dislike, you know what there hair looks like, what their eyes look like, the structure of their face etc, their voice you can pick out of a crowd

this comes from the experience of RELATIONSHIP

the Word of God is not something , it's SOMEONE

  If you hang out with someone everyday, would you not know what their house looks like and their neighborhood?

Do you see how ridiculous all this religous madness is Beloved?

As the Great Cosmic Drill Sargeant looks down on His subjects,      We say to ourselves " If I can just keep jumping through all the religous hoops for long enough, and if I fight sin hard enough , maby just maby, someday the Drill Sargeant that I call Daddy, Abba Father He might let me into His kingdom, and oh what a great day, because He will reward me for all my suffering and sacrifice and fervant religous works I did on earth . 

This whole time He has hid from me, but thats  because we are to walk by faith and not by sight and blessed are those who do not see but believe, thats what the scripture say!

 In fact I know this is all  a test from  Drill Sargeant Daddy because He knows how dedicated Iam to the cause, so He hides from me and never lets me experience His kisses and hugs, His touch, and glorious Kingdom . All this  because Iam one of those special Prophets hidden away for the great awakening at the end of the age."

what an absolute tragic way to live life with Jesus!

Iam tired of hearing about the Drill Sargeant God we serve!

God did not come to condem the world but save it. Every person in the worlds sins are already atoned for.

just believe in Christ already

The Father is waiting for you, come and TASTE AND SEE that the Lord is good!

the price is to high, you can not attain it, the only way revelators can truely come is through the blood by the power of the Holy Ghost.

 

grace Zach



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Great Grace



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 4:27am


Zach wrote:
Quote:


The Life Side. The mystery of sanctification is that the perfect qualities of Jesus Christ are imparted as a gift to me, not gradually, but instantly once I enter by faith into the realization that He "became for [me] . . . sanctification . . . ." Sanctification means nothing less than the holiness of Jesus becoming mine and being exhibited in my life.

The most wonderful secret of living a holy life does not lie in imitating Jesus, but in letting the perfect qualities of Jesus exhibit themselves in my human flesh. Sanctification is "Christ in you . . ." ( http://archive.openheaven.com/forums/http://www.biblegateway.com /passage/?search=Colossians+1:27 - ). It is His wonderful life that is imparted to me in sanctification� imparted by faith as a sovereign gift of God�s grace. Am I willing for God to make sanctification as real in me as it is in His Word?

Sanctification means the impartation of the holy qualities of Jesus Christ to me. It is the gift of His patience, love, holiness, faith, purity, and godliness that is exhibited in and through every sanctified soul. Sanctification is not drawing from Jesus the power to be holy� it is drawing from Jesus the very holiness that was exhibited in Him, and that He now exhibits in me. Sanctification is an impartation, not an imitation. Imitation is something altogether different. The perfection of everything is in Jesus Christ, and the mystery of sanctification is that all the perfect qualities of Jesus are at my disposal. Consequently, I slowly but surely begin to live a life of inexpressible order, soundness, and holiness� ". . . kept by the power of God . . ." (
http://archive.openheaven.com/forums/http://www.biblegateway.com /passage/?search=1+Peter+1:5 -   ).


AMEN AND AMEN! This is the works that James talked about. This means that we do NOT continue in sin because the grace of God the empowerment of Christ Jesus in our heart brings it to pass. We live holy and apart from sin because we reckon ourselves DEAD to sin but alive unto God. It is the love and the power grace of God causing a pure holy clean life apart from sin.

The sick thing is to claim that grace covers our sin and though we continue in sinful living God sees us as holy. God is not blind and knows our hearts. If we continue in sin we are NOT yet holy. It is the mercy and longsuffering of God that keeps on working with us as we continue in faith to repent and turn back to Him until grace has done its work and we are a mature clean holy son of God dead to the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life.

Entering the New Jerusalem - kingdom of God lifestyle requires the practical reality of this holiness. The process takes place outside the New Jerusalem city of God. This is not about going to heaven when we die at all. This is about the kingdom of God lifestyle now in this life. We will never enter this life of holiness and true intimate oneness with God and continue in sinful living. We will come into full obedience to the law of love that exceeds the laws of the Old Testament. This is the New Testament reality of holy living in Christ and Christ in us.

Ron




Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 5:13am

Ron I guess what Iam trying to say is first

FOR THE RECORD I HATE SIN

WE DO NOT SIN AND JUST CLAIM GRACE, CERTAINLY NOT!

HOWEVER WE CAN LIVE THE CLAENST PUREST LIFE

BUT...........................

I dare any person when they are standing before God to give them the list of all their good works, THAT KEY WILL NOT ALLOW YOU TO ENETER IN TO THE KINGDOM...NEVER, NEVER, NEVER,

to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord

the believer before the Lord is a whole lot different than the unbeliever who stands before God at the end of his days (AND WE WILL ALL COME BEFORE THE KING) 

but notice the believer is ALREADY BEFORE THE KING BEFORE THE LIST OF GOOODWORKS IS PULLED OUT, AND THE RECORD BOOKS ARE OPENED!

 did you guys catch that one, the believer ALREADY HAS ACCESSTO GOD, before they are rewarded for all their work (done in love) is even mentioned

It is His good work at the cross, the blood is the key and the Spirit takes us through with boldness at anytime NO MATTER HOW GOOD OR BAD YOUR WALK IS

you just have to believe.............

Do we come to God and say " I have been good lately, I have walked in victory here and over here etc and out comes the list so let me into the throne room?

Wheres the sacrifice of the cross in that(Christs cross)

not His working through us, but yes His cross working in us, is a daily reality .

You see it's by His blood that we enter into the Most Holy Place

No man can boast here about His lifestyle or lack of one

It's all Jesus............very simple, and very narrow

However, I believe you can be born again and walk in the flesh and gross sin with out a repentant heart and miss the kingdom on a "DAILY BASIS" because the lack of consecration in your life!

HOWEVER, THE DOOR REMAINS OPEN

God does reward the seeker and the hungry heart gets filled But again all the promises are YES AND AMEN IN CHRIST

lets say someone was in gross sin, how could they get out or be "set free?"

Jesus is the one that has to loose them from that wich their enslaved too,

my point being , THEY CAN STILL GET ACCESS TO GOD THATS THE ONLY PERSON THAT CAN DO ANYTHING ABOUT THEIR SITUATION.

the scary thing is, God has so much for us in this lifetime and we will MISS OUT ON SO MUCH if we live a life that is not sober and bathed in prayer and fellowship ,accountability etc

hopefully that clears things up a bit

for some

IAM NOT SAYING, LIVE ANY WAY YOU WANT!

I AM NOT SAYING SIN IS NOT COSTLY ETC !

What Iam saying is " we no matter how hard we try can not change our nature" and your flesh will be as rotten as it is today a hundred years from now

but we do not have to let it reign in us thats for sure

thats whats amazing about the Love of God.......................

the believer who has busted his hump for 50 years and the drug addict thief who repents on his death bed both spend eternity in paradise together

all coming boldly THROUGH THE BLOOD OF THE LAMB

when we taste and see the Lord is good , we will not want to sin

zach



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Great Grace



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 6:51am

Zach, Yes, I think we all understand we cannot work our way to heaven. So why keep harping on that????? This thread is not about that in fact this entire ministry is not about that. The FAR greater danger today is the multitudes who think because they made a commitment of some sort at some time they are saved when they are living in hell on earth without any reality of God moving in their lives. This is possibly most Christians in the western church. They believe that all is well with God and they have all they need and that just because they are sleeping with their neighbors wife and stealing from their employer does not mean they are sinners. They believe that the blood of Jesus paid for their continued sinful life without any evidence of God.

They will say that if they were to decide to stop sinning it would be filthy rags of human works. Eventually this leads them to Universalism in which they believe a loving God would not punish anyone. Much of the Christian church may be trusting in a lie and have no real understanding of the kingdom of God now.

Zach, NO WHERE on this thread is anyone talking about works of MAN. That is except you. Please stop speaking to us as though we were. 

Get real we do have a part and that is to believe and because we believe we will decide. We all have a decision to make any time temptation presents itself. Temptation is common to man and overcoming is common only to a remnant of the people who call themselves Christian. We should be overcomers in Christ believe and decide to DRAW NEAR to God and RESIST the devil. DO NOT walk with the devil and believe God does not see.

We are not just to overcome in our lives but overcome the works of the devil in the world. That is what Christ in us does. He that is in us has OVERCOME the world. We are not to be sinners but are to be transformed by the renewing of our minds. What! We are to have a part in renewing out minds!? Oh My God! It matters what we think about and what we trust in and how we receive the Spirit of Christ and how we hear what He is saying and how we turn away from listening to lies of religious spirits and other voices from the dark side. Brothers and sisters it matters what you read and what you hear and what you see. You must choose what you feed you mind and soul upon. Holiness is a work of Christ in us but we do NOT all have it if we do not WALK IN THE SPIRIT and that is a choice we can make.

I believe I have the mind of Christ when I say I am sick of greasy cheap lying grace that is not grace at all. Literally it makes me sick to hear anyone who speaks of true holiness in Christ accused of trusting in works of man. My God can we not see that anyone living in sin and believing they are holy is deceived.

Zach I love you but will you stop this crusade of speaking of holiness as though it was works of man. It is works of God but it is real and where Christ is holy living is coming about. AGAIN THIS IS NOT ABOUT GETTING TO HEAVEN - THIS IS ABOUT THE KINGDOM OF GOD AND THE NEW JERUSALEM BRIDE OF CHRIST BEING FORMED NOW ON EARTH. And positional holiness will not get anyone into the New Jerusalem life. Nothing shall enter that defiles. DRAW NEAR TO GOD and RESIST the devil. Let patience have here perfect work as the grace (influence of God on our hearts) make us completely holy just as He is holy. for real.

Ron

 




Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 7:58am

Dear Ron,

PHILLIPIANS 3:1 finally , my brethren, rejoice in the Lord, TO WRITE THE SAME THINGS AGAIN is no trouble to me, and it is a safeguard for you.

Rons quote:

Zach, Yes, I think we all understand we cannot work our way to heaven. So why keep harping on that????? This thread is not about that in fact this entire ministry is not about that. The FAR greater danger today is the multitudes who think because they made a commitment of some sort at some time they are saved when they are living in hell on earth without any reality of God moving in their lives. This is possibly most Christians in the western church. They believe that all is well with God and they have all they need and that just because they are sleeping with their neighbors wife and stealing from their employer does not mean they are sinners. They believe that the blood of Jesus paid for their continued sinful life without any evidence of God.

RON I agree that those sins mentioned are rotten and those practicing this behaviour should wonder maby are they saved,

 However Iam just coming from a different standpoint  for we all "see in part"

 HOW MANY PEOPLE THINK BECAUSE THEY DO ALL THE "GOOD WORKS" ASSUME THEY ARE SAVED?

those who have no works but the blood of Jesus get into the big show at the end of their days here!

those who have all the works and none of Jesus blood are left out!

pure and simple...................

Iam letting it all ride on the blood of the lamb

but I will still show you my faith by what I do

So my emphasis is the cross, the grace , the mercy, and out of that relationship and unconditional love will become obediant NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND

if BELIEVERS  are trapped and living in all kinds of sin etc, telling them God dislikes them , is angry with them , He will judge them  ETC

THAT WILL NOT SET THEM FREE,

repentance is the "kindness and goodness" of God, .They must receive that first in order to "walk out the life"

THIS IS THE HARP GOD HAS PLACED IN MY MOUTH AND HANDS

Remember the guy in the bible crying out SON OF DAVID HAVE MERCY! " The crowd told him to be quiet but he shouted all the more

you are right I think sometimes I throw something in a post that is not is the same vein as whats going on, thanks for pointing that out, However there are times I do it on purpose

selah.............

I agree their is a treading out, there is resisting the devil and all kinds of choices we must make daily

there is a race to run and we shall get the prize

your insight is always helpful

Zach

 

p.s. the bible is clear the way of the transgressor is hard



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Great Grace



Posted By: Vince Sucec
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 8:49am

Very interesting Ron, thanks ... I really like your interpretation of suffering ... that God may rest upon us ...

Question please - can you explain the relationship between sin and suffering or pain as you mentioned above, I mean is pain used to remove sin?

If the power of sin is death then Life must remove sin ... His Life ... so we must die to our lives to recieve His Life. So in a way we have to go to the cross to die. He was the first - made the way of the cross evident. It is interesting to me that in John He said that He will not take us out of the world - that we must suffer here ... that as he was so are we in this world. There is a relationship there between suffering and following him to the cross that is so profound. I guess the question is functionally how did He take the keys of death hell and the grave - what did He do ?

I know we are told that dealing with sin is just a matter of substitution and yet if that were all there was to the definition then why must we suffer as part of the redemption process....

 

 



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Until we all come into the unity of the faith ...



Posted By: Vince Sucec
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 10:59am

Everyone see Kira's post - wow answers the question I had above ...

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Until we all come into the unity of the faith ...



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 11:10am


One more time Zach, This thread is not about works vs mercy and grace. It is not about getting to heaven when we die. It is about living the New Jerusalem lifestyle NOW. You cannot experience the kingdom lifestyle now on this earth with sin in your heart and life. Jesus preached, taught and demonstrated the gospel of the kingdom not the gospel of salvation to go to heaven. The gospel of salvation that you are preaching and that most of the church has preached for centuries is a part of the gospel of the kingdom. It is the beginning part but ONLY a part.

Times are changing. The revelation of the kingdom is here and there are places where your message of not trusting in your good deeds or works to make heaven has an audience who need it. It does not fit on this thread and really not on this prophesy forum. Especially it does not need to be shouted here in capital letters, red letters and bold type over and over and over again. If you will not stop I will have to deal with this distraction and diversion. If you are getting the message of real holiness produced by Christ in us and the now kingdom potential to become the purified Bride, the New Jerusalem, then please lets talk about it. Please.

Keep on pursuing love. It never fails
and His kingdom never ends.

Ron McGatlin
Coordinator OpenHeaven.com

http://archive.openheaven.com/" target=_blank eudora="autourl - archive.openheaven.com
mailto:basileia@earthlink.net - basileia@earthlink.net



Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 11:50am

Iam totally for a Holy Lifestyle, as for posting on this specific thread you may be right on that.

As for the prophecy forum you may be right again. What i do know a little bit about is the testimony of Jesus is the Sprit of prophecy and people are tired of never measuring up.

people can not walk in what your calling them into unless the "FOUNDATION OF THE CROSS " IS LAID IN THEIR HEARTS"

thats just it, people are not walking in the holiness that you guys are calling them into because the foundation of the cross has not taken root in their hearts yet 

the church walks out the Holiness from the revelation of a Saviour who loves them.

not the other way around

Holiness does not produce intamacy

INTAMACY PRODUCES HOLINESS.

proverbs 8:1:-3

sorry aboutall  the bold letters,I will try not to so much  and for the color after all these months on a computer I just realized I could do it, Iam like a kid with a new paint set 

theres a lot of color in heaven be forwarned I was there once or twice.........it's actually alive and dancing too, some colors you can even taste

zach



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Great Grace



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 2:34pm

Zach, if they have not the cross then they have not Jesus. You are exactly right that holiness come from intimacy not the other way round. It is all grace and it is all Christ Jesus in us. I sincerely appreciate your desire and your work to bring us to more of Jesus. I do not understand how it is that "you guys" and I guess that means me are calling for anything else. Do you still feel someway that "us guys" are trying to get people to try to be holy by their works??? Or is it that you just do not want to believe that we really can walk in real holiness in this life?

There is a cross that we take up. Is that the cross you are speaking of. If so then I am in agreement that some folks are not yet. However, there are probably more people on this forum than you would think who are denying themselves and are taking up their cross what ever that means to each of us. Our aim is not to try to get people to work in their flesh to stop sinning. "Our" meaning my aim is to get them to know that they can come to a place in Christ and Christ in them where the do not have to sin. Where they can become holy in this life and enter the rest that God has provided. They really can enter the New Jerusalem kingdom of God lifestyle and they can do the same works that Jesus did because it is Him doing those works by His Spirit within.

All of that sure beats just talking about being holy because Jesus died on the cross for us and never getting to the resurrection. As it says in the original post here.

Quote:

Perhaps the greatest aspect of the grace of God is the indwelling Christ totally influencing our hearts and reflecting out in our lives. Yes, it is the work of God and something that no natural man can do, but it is not a covering for sin. It is the gift of power to annihilate sin and set us free to live holy lives in this world. The mercy of God forgives our sin through the cross. The grace of God destroys our sinful ways by the resurrection life of Christ empowering us to live pure and holy lives as Christ lives in us.

Rom 5:10: For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (His life in us.)
 
Completed salvation by grace through faith includes cleansing from sin as well as forgiveness of sin.

It is the resurrected life of Christ that lives in us to establish His kingdom in us and in the world. Biblical salvation includes this life being saved from sin unto the good works of the resurrected Christ in and through us.

Zach, Thanks for you patient consideration and please consider these scripture and comments here carefully. God is taking us all to deeper places in Him. What he is doing in us so fills us that it leaves no room for the flesh.

Much love and respect,

Ron




Posted By: Zach Dixon
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 3:40pm

Ron, thanks for being pateient with me, I guess I continue to echoe the cross because it's the part or "that part of it" thats been revealed and being revealed to me.

I remember about ten years ago I was  in sin and I hopped into a cab and this little old man and ( i was pretty scary at the time) looked right at me with out blinking an eye and said"you would rather dwell in the tents of wickedness than the house of my God!"

I never met the man in my life, I had seen him for a whole ten seconds!

sobering to say the least, this guy pierced my heart with that word

Iam hearing a little more clear now..............sorry for any haughtyness on my part recently willing to be corrected and learn

shalom.....Zach



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Great Grace



Posted By: Bojo Sun
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 3:58pm

Dear Ron and Zach:

Thank you for your example here. I am most certain that our Father is
well pleased.

Zach, what a wonderful moment of your life you shared here! May the
Lord continue to use us and use others unto us in such wonderful ways...

Indeed, much grace will be poured out unto those who are humble and
pure...

Ron, thank you for speaking truth with much grace and love...Thank you
for your father's heart unto His little ones. The Lord bless you!

Praise be unto His Holy Name!

Love you!

Sun



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 5:26pm

Why am I shedding tears? Is it love or much feeling of humility or is it joy and thanksgiving at the goodness of our God?

Thank you Father for the wonderful love between brothers. You are glorious Lord Jesus and oh so close.

Love to all.

Ron




Posted By: Gayle Getz
Date Posted: 03/19/2009 at 5:35pm

  You'all touched this here heart-luv yous

-------------
Shalom-nothing missing, nothing broken-Gayle



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/20/2009 at 5:48am

2 Cor 12:9: And He said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness." Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
In a very real sense, our sorrow is turned into joy, His joy. We enter greater peace and rest in the warmth of His love, glory abounds within and flows the joy of the Lord outwardly in strength to a needy world around us. Through the sorrow of the pain of the loss of our self-focused ambitions, we become fountains of living water flowing into the dry lands of our brothers and sisters. We become lights of love and joy in the deep darkness of a world of people who have gone astray from the God who formed them. The love of God is the primary ministry of His sent ones sent into this life to suffer for righteousness sake, imparting the kingdom of God and His righteousness into the world.
1 Pet 4:12: Beloved, do not think it strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened to you; but rejoice to the extent that you partake of Christ's sufferings, that when His glory is revealed, you may also be glad with exceeding joy. If you are reproached for the name of Christ, blessed are you, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. On their part He is blasphemed, but on your part He is glorified.
Jesus did not come to build our kingdoms.
The comforter did not come to encourage and sustain us in our pursuit of other gods and self-reliant building of our kingdoms of pleasure-seeking and the love of money and the things it will buy. Our pride in our abilities and cunning works of competitive accomplishments will be broken to pieces and dissolved before we truly enter the kingdom of heaven lifestyle. The fall of our personal and corporate Babylon is part of the death beyond which we enter the resurrection life of Christ Jesus filling our spirit, soul, and body with His supernatural life of love and power from heaven.
Father, we thank you for the pain of death that leads to resurrection life, filling us with the glorious reality of Christ’s life of pure holy love. We receive your progressive holiness clearing the land of our hearts from darkness part by part until there remains no place for the darkness of the enemy. From the inner core of our spirit to the extremities of our soul and body let your holiness progressively occupy until we are pure and holy as You are holy. Thank You, Father, that we are not trapped in sin and can truly live and walk by the Spirit in Christ with Christ fully living in our earthly bodies in holiness. Thank You for the pain of death that produces progressive holiness filling every cell of our body and every moment and movement of our lives. Amen
PAIN + FORGIVENESS = LOVE (A real flow of love will begin to be experienced)
PAIN + RESENTMENT = BITTERNESS (Leading to many types of defilement)
1 Pet 2:19-21;  For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
Ron



Posted By: Ron McGatlin
Date Posted: 03/23/2009 at 4:17am

Pain will make us better or bitter. What are you doing with your pain? Don't waste your pain.

PAIN + FORGIVENESS = LOVE (A real flow of love will begin to be experienced)
PAIN + RESENTMENT = BITTERNESS (Leading to many types of defilement)
1 Pet 2:19-21;  For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully. For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God. For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
Ron



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