Posted: 09/10/2008 at 10:43am | IP Logged

Modern Idols And False Prophets

Terry Somerville

Jeremiah 23:16 "Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they teach you vanity; they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of Jehovah."

In both the old and New Testament we are repeatedly warned about idols and false prophets. Today, both are in the church. The idols look Christian, and the prophets may do miracles and signs! They may even speak true words like Balaam. But he was a false prophet because he did not lead the people into faithfulness to God.

The issue here is not the power to prophecy, signs etc, it is the heart of the prophet, his character and teaching. The true ministry of a prophet is to bring fidelity to Christ, but as we shall see there is much false prophecy when idolatry increases in God's people.

Jeremiah 23: 21 I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied. 22 But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.

Mt 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves

Mt 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

True and False Sources of Prophecy

True prophecy is inspired by the spirit of the Lord. But the scripture makes it clear that God's prophets may speak from other sources! Note carefully how prophets can speak from their own heart and spirit but think it is the Lord!

Sources Of Prophecy

1. The prophets own heart

Ez 13:2 …say thou unto them that prophesy out of their own hearts, Hear ye the word of the LORD;

Jer 23: 26 How long shall there be lies in the heart of the prophets. They are prophets of the deceit of their own heart;

2. The Prophets Own Mind

Jer 23:16 They speak a vision of their own minds, and not from the mouth of the LORD.

3. The Prophets Own Spirit

Ez 13:3 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing!

4. A Demon

Jeremiah 23:13 And I have seen folly in the prophets of Samaria; they prophesied in Baal, and caused my people Israel to err"

Micah 2:11 If a man walking in the spirit and falsehood do lie, saying, I will prophesy unto thee of wine and of strong drink; he shall even be the prophet of this people.

Idols In The Heart Of Christians and The Prophets

Idol worship still tempts Christians converts in India. They believe certain fears, needs or desires may be answered by these false gods. Why do we think our spiritual life in the west is any different just because we don't bow to a graven image? Idolatry of the heart is rampant! As far as the Lord is concerned it is real idolatry and serving an image in the place of God!

Here is how it idolatry of the heart works.

1. Our Heart Is Gods Temple

I Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2. Idols Can Be Taken Into The Heart

Ezekiel 14:3 Son of man, these men have set up their idols in their heart, and put the stumblingblock of their iniquity before their face: should I be enquired of at all by them?

3. Images and Pictures In The Heart Are The Idols

Ezekiel 8:10 behold every form of creeping things, and abominable beasts, and all the idols of the house of Israel, pourtrayed upon the wall round about.

4. Covetousness (Desiring These Images) Is Idolatry

Colossians 3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

5. The Flesh Serves The Idol Resulting In Unrighteousness

James 3:14 But if you have bitter jealousy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast and be false to the truth. This wisdom is not such as comes down from above, but is earthly, unspiritual, devilish. For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there will be disorder and every vile practice.

The Question is, what are the pictures, ideas and images portrayed in your heart? What desires possess you? Are they Kingdom ideas or western culture?

My Own Experience

Many years ago the Lord confronted my about my idol worship. It was a revelation. I had three idol-pictures in my heart, covetous desires that I served. He revealed them by putting me through difficult circumstances. I needed to smash them down!

1. The Idol Of Ministry

I had a picture in my heart of "successful ministry". Even though it was all about REVIVAL, the pictures on the walls of my heart were created by the idols of our culture. Success, fame, youth, size, power etc. I prayed for it, prophesied it, and preached it. Because it was religious I could not see that my ministry had become my idol. My flesh served the idol. I was glad or depressed depending on the results.

2. The Idol Of My Wife

I also had an idol-picture in my heart of what I wanted my wife Karen to be like. It was an image of how I wanted her to look and act. I had fallen in love with this picture in my heart I coveted, instead of loving her. My flesh served the idol because I was glad when Karen was like the image, and upset when she was not.

3. The Idol Of My Home

God used our circumstances to expose this one. We moved to Campbell River from a water front home in Bermuda. For several years I would see images of the home we left behind every morning when I put my contact lenses in. I rebuked the devil but it was not him, it was my idol controlling my heart! I was miserable and tormented but could get free in my heart until I smashed this idol.

The Idols Of The Church Are Producing Todays False Prophets

The idols of our culture are being served in the church. But we don't see them because they are often equated with Christianity. Perhaps the greatest one is the idol of revival! I believe in genuine revival. But what the prophets are prophesying and what the people are chasing is NOT revival. It is an IDOL OF REVIVAL.

REVIVAL IDOLS

• Success and fame. Everyone will come!
• Size - We'll "catch it" and our church will grow.
• Money - the offerings will bring financial blessing
• Power and Influence. We will be respected as leaders
• Spectacles of spiritual power

THE PROPHETS OF REVIVAL

The idolatry around the church today has produced many prophets of revival who speak from their own minds and spirits. They serve these idols in their hearts. They rely on spectacular revelations to boost their ministries. The draw is signs and wonders and spiritual experiences. Believers serving the gods of the land will run because of the name and fame of these ministries. They say "I am of Paul, I am of Appolos", it is not the Lord.

Check Out The Prophets and Their Prophecy

1 Thessalonians 5:21 but test everything; hold fast what is good,

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Here are Some Tests for Prophecy and Prophets

1. The Word Of God – does it fit the Word of God ?

Psalms 119:160 Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever.

2. The spirit of the prophecy – does it bear witness of Christ in word and spirit?

1John 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

3. The character of the message – Does it lead to holiness?

Jer 23:22 But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.

4. Confirmation - Do other prophets and prophecy agree?

1Cor.14:29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh (discern) what is said.

5. The character of the messenger

Jer 23:14 I have seen also in the prophets of Jerusalem an horrible thing: they commit adultery, and walk in lies: they strengthen also the hands of evildoers, that none doth return from his wickedness:

21 I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied.

Conclusion - The Church Must Repent Of Her Idols

The great need of the day is cleansing of the church from the idols of the land. We should not be surprised at the behavior of ministries in our day. We are in the grip of a terrible idolatry that rules much of the church and inspires many prophets. Most faithful Old Testament prophets could not convince God's people they had a problem with false gods. Many prophets ended up serving those false gods in the name of Jehovah! The same is true today.

It is time for a great repentance, and abandoning of the idols of our time. We pray that God will give us eyes to see.

I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Revelation of John 3:18

Posted: 09/10/2008 at 11:23am | IP Logged

Bojo

Wow powrerful post.   True prophets seek Him,  not man, but get one on one with God.  To know the oracles of Him.   Turly in these days, it is critical to hear the voice of the Master.    Then to act on what is true from His heart to distribute to the places, and those need a word in the night.    

The Lord hath given me the tongue of the learned, that I should know how to speak a word in season to him that is weary  Isaiah 50:4

Truly this is needed in critical times as these...   only to speak what He has told us to speak and do....

Rose

Posted: 09/10/2008 at 3:44pm | IP Logged

NIV
[Dt 12:29-13:18]

²⁹ The Lord your God will cut off before you the nations you are about to invade and dispossess. But when you have driven them out and settled in their land, ³⁰ and after they have been destroyed before you, be careful not to be ensnared by inquiring about their gods, saying, “How do these nations serve their gods? We will do the same.” ³¹ You must not worship the Lord your God in their way, because in worshiping their gods, they do all kinds of detestable things the Lord hates. They even burn their sons and daughters in the fire as sacrifices to their gods.

³² See that you do all I command you; do not add to it or take away from it.

¹ If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a miraculous sign or wonder, ² and if the sign or wonder of which he has spoken takes place, and he says, “Let us follow other gods” (gods you have not known) “and let us worship them,” ³ you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The Lord your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul. ⁴ It is the Lord your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. ⁵ That prophet or dreamer must be put to death, because he preached rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery; he has tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you.

⁶ If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, ⁷ gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), ⁸ do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. ⁹ You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people. ¹⁰ Stone him to death, because he tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. ¹¹ Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

¹² If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in ¹³ that wicked men have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), ¹⁴ then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, ¹⁵ you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. Destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. ¹⁶ Gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. It is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt. ¹⁷ None of those condemned things shall be found in your hands, so that the Lord will turn from his fierce anger; he will show you mercy, have compassion on you, and increase your numbers, as he promised on oath to your forefathers, ¹⁸ because you obey the Lord your God, keeping all his commands that I am giving you today and doing what is right in his eyes.

Jer 7-9

NIV
[Zec 9:14-11:3]

¹⁴ Then the Lord will appear over them;

his arrow will flash like lightning.

The Sovereign Lord will sound the trumpet;

he will march in the storms of the south,

¹⁵ and the Lord Almighty will shield them.

They will destroy

and overcome with slingstones.

They will drink and roar as with wine;

they will be full like a bowl

used for sprinkling the corners of the

altar.

¹⁶ The Lord their God will save them on that day

as the flock of his people.

They will sparkle in his land

like jewels in a crown.

¹⁷ How attractive and beautiful they will be!

Grain will make the young men thrive,

and new wine the young women.

¹ Ask the Lord for rain in the springtime;

it is the Lord who makes the storm clouds.

He gives showers of rain to men,

and plants of the field to everyone.

² The idols speak deceit,

diviners see visions that lie;

they tell dreams that are false,

they give comfort in vain.

Therefore the people wander like sheep

oppressed for lack of a shepherd.

³ “My anger burns against the shepherds,

and I will punish the leaders;

for the Lord Almighty will care

for his flock, the house of Judah,

and make them like a proud horse in battle.

⁴ From Judah will come the cornerstone,

from him the tent peg,

from him the battle bow,

from him every ruler.

⁵ Together they will be like mighty men

trampling the muddy streets in battle.

Because the Lord is with them,

they will fight and overthrow the horsemen.

⁶ “I will strengthen the house of Judah

and save the house of Joseph.

I will restore them

because I have compassion on them.

They will be as though

I had not rejected them,

for I am the Lord their God

and I will answer them.

⁷ The Ephraimites will become like mighty men,

and their hearts will be glad as with wine.

Their children will see it and be joyful;

their hearts will rejoice in the Lord.

⁸ I will signal for them

and gather them in.

Surely I will redeem them;

they will be as numerous as before.

⁹ Though I scatter them among the peoples,

yet in distant lands they will remember me.

They and their children will survive,

and they will return.

¹⁰ I will bring them back from Egypt

and gather them from Assyria.

I will bring them to Gilead and Lebanon,

and there will not be room enough for them.

¹¹ They will pass through the sea of trouble;

the surging sea will be subdued

and all the depths of the Nile will dry up.

Assyria’s pride will be brought down

and Egypt’s scepter will pass away.

¹² I will strengthen them in the Lord

and in his name they will walk,”

declares the Lord.

¹ Open your doors, O Lebanon,

so that fire may devour your cedars!

² Wail, O pine tree, for the cedar has fallen;

the stately trees are ruined!

Wail, oaks of Bashan;

the dense forest has been cut down!

³ Listen to the wail of the shepherds;

their rich pastures are destroyed!

Listen to the roar of the lions;

the lush thicket of the Jordan is ruined!

NIV
[Zec 12:10-13:9]

¹⁰ “And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son. ¹¹ On that day the weeping in Jerusalem will be great, like the weeping of Hadad Rimmon in the plain of Megiddo. ¹² The land will mourn, each clan by itself, with their wives by themselves: the clan of the house of David and their wives, the clan of the house of Nathan and their wives, ¹³ the clan of the house of Levi and their wives, the clan of Shimei and their wives, ¹⁴ and all the rest of the clans and their wives.

¹ “On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.

² “On that day, I will banish the names of the idols from the land, and they will be remembered no more,” declares the Lord Almighty. “I will remove both the prophets and the spirit of impurity from the land. ³ And if anyone still prophesies, his father and mother, to whom he was born, will say to him, ‘You must die, because you have told lies in the Lord’s name.’ When he prophesies, his own parents will stab him.

⁴ “On that day every prophet will be ashamed of his prophetic vision. He will not put on a prophet’s garment of hair in order to deceive. ⁵ He will say, ‘I am not a prophet. I am a farmer; the land has been my livelihood since my youth.’ ⁶ If someone asks him, ‘What are these wounds on your body?’ he will answer, ‘The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.’

⁷ “Awake, O sword, against my shepherd,

against the man who is close to me!”

declares the Lord Almighty.

“Strike the shepherd,

and the sheep will be scattered,

and I will turn my hand against the little ones.

⁸ In the whole land,” declares the Lord,

“two-thirds will be struck down and perish;

yet one-third will be left in it.

⁹ This third I will bring into the fire;

I will refine them like silver

and test them like gold.

They will call on my name

and I will answer them;

I will say, ‘They are my people,’

and they will say, ‘The Lord is our God.’”

---

NIV
[Is 11:10-13:22]

¹⁰ In that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the peoples; the nations will rally to him, and his place of rest will be glorious. ¹¹ In that day the Lord will reach out his hand a second time to reclaim the remnant that is left of his people from Assyria, from Lower Egypt, from Upper Egypt, from Cush, from Elam, from Babylonia, from Hamath and from the islands of the sea.

¹² He will raise a banner for the nations

and gather the exiles of Israel;

he will assemble the scattered people of Judah

from the four quarters of the earth.

¹³ Ephraim’s jealousy will vanish,

and Judah’s enemies will be cut off;

Ephraim will not be jealous of Judah,

nor Judah hostile toward Ephraim.

¹⁴ They will swoop down on the slopes of Philistia to the west;

together they will plunder the people to the east.

They will lay hands on Edom and Moab,

and the Ammonites will be subject to them.

¹⁵ The Lord will dry up

the gulf of the Egyptian sea;

with a scorching wind he will sweep his hand

over the Euphrates River.

He will break it up into seven streams

so that men can cross over in sandals.

¹⁶ There will be a highway for the remnant of his people

that is left from Assyria,

as there was for Israel

when they came up from Egypt.

¹ In that day you will say:

“I will praise you, O Lord.

Although you were angry with me,

your anger has turned away

and you have comforted me.

² Surely God is my salvation;

I will trust and not be afraid.

The Lord, the Lord, is my strength and my song;

he has become my salvation.”

³ With joy you will draw water

from the wells of salvation.

⁴ In that day you will say:

“Give thanks to the Lord, call on his name;

make known among the nations what he has done,

and proclaim that his name is exalted.

⁵ Sing to the Lord, for he has done glorious things;

let this be known to all the world.

⁶ Shout aloud and sing for joy, people of Zion,

for great is the Holy One of Israel among you.”

¹ An oracle concerning Babylon that Isaiah son of Amoz saw:

² Raise a banner on a bare hilltop,

shout to them;

beckon to them

to enter the gates of the nobles.

³ I have commanded my holy ones;

I have summoned my warriors to carry out my wrath—

those who rejoice in my triumph.

⁴ Listen, a noise on the mountains,

like that of a great multitude!

Listen, an uproar among the kingdoms,

like nations massing together!

The Lord Almighty is mustering

an army for war.

⁵ They come from faraway lands,

from the ends of the heavens—

the Lord and the weapons of his wrath—

to destroy the whole country.

⁶ Wail, for the day of the Lord is near;

it will come like destruction from the Almighty.

⁷ Because of this, all hands will go limp,

every man’s heart will melt.

⁸ Terror will seize them,

pain and anguish will grip them;

they will writhe like a woman in labor.

They will look aghast at each other,

their faces aflame.

⁹ See, the day of the Lord is coming

—a cruel day, with wrath and fierce anger—

to make the land desolate

and destroy the sinners within it.

¹⁰ The stars of heaven and their constellations

will not show their light.

The rising sun will be darkened

and the moon will not give its light.

¹¹ I will punish the world for its evil,

the wicked for their sins.

I will put an end to the arrogance of the haughty

and will humble the pride of the ruthless.

¹² I will make man scarcer than pure gold,

more rare than the gold of Ophir.

¹³ Therefore I will make the heavens tremble;

and the earth will shake from its place

at the wrath of the Lord Almighty,

in the day of his burning anger.

¹⁴ Like a hunted gazelle,

like sheep without a shepherd,

each will return to his own people,

each will flee to his native land.

¹⁵ Whoever is captured will be thrust through;

all who are caught will fall by the sword.

¹⁶ Their infants will be dashed to pieces before their eyes;

their houses will be looted and their wives ravished.

¹⁷ See, I will stir up against them the Medes,

who do not care for silver

and have no delight in gold.

¹⁸ Their bows will strike down the young men;

they will have no mercy on infants

nor will they look with compassion on children.

¹⁹ Babylon, the jewel of kingdoms,

the glory of the Babylonians’ pride,

will be overthrown by God

like Sodom and Gomorrah.

²⁰ She will never be inhabited

or lived in through all generations;

no Arab will pitch his tent there,

no shepherd will rest his flocks there.

²¹ But desert creatures will lie there,

jackals will fill her houses;

there the owls will dwell,

and there the wild goats will leap about.

²² Hyenas will howl in her strongholds,

jackals in her luxurious palaces.

Her time is at hand,

and her days will not be prolonged.

Posted: 09/10/2008 at 6:21pm | IP Logged

how can I tell if a person is False Prophets or True Prophets?

how I test spirit? can anyone tell? thanks.

God bless you

Posted: 09/10/2008 at 6:32pm | IP Logged

Dear Rose:

What a wonderful thing to hear the Lord tells us his dealings and timing! May He richly bless you and firmly establish you! Keep me in your precious prayer!

Dear John and Tony:

I enjoy greatly your exchanges here. Wonderfully put, dear brother......Sanctification is an integrate part of our life in the spirit and was included in His Grace, expounded by Paul as work of the Spirit after justification, which will progressively be introduced to our spirit, soul and body. And it has great to do the discipline by our heavenly Father.

I have a brother summed up my discussion with him recently and would like share, which really is common knowledge. Only hope they are of help a bit.

----------

Sanctification?

    Sanctification is the process of a man being transformed into the likeness of God and brought into the governance of the Lord. It begins in the inner most being of man which is his spirit, secondly goes to the soul, and finally to the body. This is a reality within us that is foreshadowed by the temple in the Old Testament which was made up of the Holy of Holies, the Inner Courts, and the Outer Courts. The process will manifest itself after it flows from the inner most part of the man, to His soul and to his body. The Spirit will sanctify the man through and through in order to make him pure and blameless before the Lord. This process can take a lifetime. This process is like gold refined by fire because the dross and the impurities are burned away by the fire in order to produce the pure gold. It was created for the purpose of showing by example how a man is sanctified and has high value for this very reason because God ordained the process in this way. Anything that does not fall into this process of sanctification will be burned away so that only the pure and holy things will remain. Sanctification is the process of producing the fullness of Christ in us. It will bring about the Mind of Christ in a man. A man is mature when he has the Mind of Christ and this will take time. This is the process of God making us perfect or bringing about perfection in us which is the life of Christ.

      It begins with learning to be governed by the Holy Spirit. This is done through the process of yielding to the leading of the Spirit and His governance. An infant does not reflect the character of the Father in the beginning however over time as you mature as a son you will reflect the Character of the Father. As you become acquainted with the ways of the Spirit, the Father and the Son will be revealed.? Your life must first come into order with the ways of the Spirit, and then Glory of God will come. The Spirit has substance and weight. When the heart is right and truly desires the Lord, the Spirit will come. The Spirit does not yield to the interests of man and will also bring in discipline in order to produce the necessary result for sanctification. This is done in love and is used to train the Son in righteousness.

     The Glory of God is invisible and the Lord can't wait to pour His Glory into us for He desires to do so. We are the vessels for His Glory. This begins with laying the firm foundation of Christ Jesus which is laid by others. Secondly, we must be put into order for the Glory to come. We are brought into order for the purpose of being established in the Lord and to keep us from being moved by external things. Our spirit, soul, and body must come into the order and governance of the Spirit of the Lord. We must come into this order before the Glory will come. Just as the temple had to be built and completed for the Glory to fall, so we must be built according to the order of the Lord for the Glory to fall on us as well. We are the temple of the Lord in which His Spirit dwells.

----------

Fatherhood of God

1. The Father desires to come alongside us and help us with the instructions He gives. He desires to teach us and guide us. He does not tell us to do something without telling us how to do it because He desires to intimately teach us. The Father does not give us something to do with expectations that would produce fear but in love desires to teach the son how to do the things He told him to do.
   
2. The Father out of His abundance gives all the things necessary to do everything He tells us to do. It is out of His abundance we do everything and He had given us everything we need. We are not in lack but He has freely given all things including what we need for godliness. We are in need of nothing both physically and spiritually. The fear of lack is gone because the Father has given every spiritual blessing to us.
   
3. We are also brought into His divine order under spiritual authority. We are disciplined and trained here. We are put into our place in the Kingdom of God. This is done in order for us to be sons and it is for our good which is done through love. We are brought into this divine order to produce discipline for maturity and order for our life. The Lord disciplines those He loves and every son goes through discipline.

Posted: 09/10/2008 at 6:37pm | IP Logged

Dear Ralph:

I am sorry, but you just have to come back to the article posted in the first place. It is simply and plainly presented, which is good for me, at least. :)

Be blessed!

Posted: 09/23/2008 at 8:15am | IP Logged

Dear Ralph....

I seem to hear a deep and unldelying question here,   and as Bojo and otheres  have shared...  there is this thing =  a projection of the mind of how one can experience the idolitry involved, but alow me to speak to what you may be asking...

how can I tell if a person is False Prophets or True Prophets?

how I test spirit? can anyone tell? thanks.

Here in this scripture is the answer. In it's is a simple answer that  goes to the heart of what  is false and or what is true.

Meaning we can not tell who is False and or True via the knowledge a personal has , but we can ( as it is a way of relating in a righteous of unrighteousn manner) evaluate and or test the spirit of a man or women who claim to have via a claim to work out God Will via their election.

1 Cor. 14:32 (KJV) 
    And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.

If the prophet is true he is able to subject all of what he or she is saying openly to and for others to evaluated as knowledge and if the knowledge is good, then a bearing witness will come , manifesting the wisdom of how this work will bring and understanding to the will of God.

The false prophets will do the same , but when faced with the question of how does one move to apply that wisdon, then the next scripture came in to play.

By "play" I mean that if a tuuth is valid then there is no need to defend it, unless you are trying to porject your identiy that also is given meaning to the  artielce Bojo has presented. Meaning, to what is your idols structure , character , and function.  = some kind of work via law and or and idela of what is a correct way to prosper in you belief.

Here the Word:

Matthew 7:15 (KJV) 
    Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

And

Mark 12:38 (KJV) 
    And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,

And

Matthew 7:15-16 (KJV) 
    Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.  Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Here your question becomes revelant and you may already understand this , but it only in the relationship you have at the present that you "Ralph" can test the spirit and or spirits of those you relate to.

To do that requires those folksl proclaiming to be "somehting" via a gifting, are doing what they do in the Fruit of Gods Character or they are not. They can pretend to be in doing  , but to relate to you they ( if they have any fruit  ) = (if in the Spirit of God) can set with you in (as it is in them) to manifestes all nine atributes of the Fruit of the Holy Spirit.

If they... in what the think is a righteous way to relate to you are have no time to do so then, his or her work is a matter of their intelect only ( knowledge) and all they say may be right, the only problem is... they may not have the wisdom to lead you into the Kingdom, let alone find that righteous path for the both of you to enter the rest of God, manifested ( by the way) as peace = one of those same fruit in all you are doing to have a life.

The false is given over to his or her own righteous to impress you on the out side = mind  as to what  they see or can show you, and yet on the inside they can not feel the heart or mind of Christ because they cannot feel Him in Character, to allow you to feel Waht the King, Who is Christ feels

As a working prophet viamy election I am in my servece to Christ to do both in being a prophet in my being in Christ. If then not in Him , well I need to have a "outward standing personality, dress the part  and  ahve some kind of ministery to prove my idenity and last but not least a book.

To have church so as to do church requires a man or women to have knowledge and they do, but in this approach , what wisdom they have is directed to the worship of and ideal that seems right in form, but without character it's at war and must go to war in its' "self preservation" ... you know to be a "big ministery"

One more thing, False prophets given over to fear of losing their identity "go silent" = recluse in they dealing with the turth prophets, bcause if they try to carry on in fellowship, they know their like of wisdom will be exposed. So it's off to doing ministery at the expence of seeting down to see as well as feel what might be true in principle.

Dressed as sheep they will putyou under their care, just long enought to eat you as well as anything else you can pay up to keep them fat, so you know it's hard to get to know your sheep , so why do that if you know you have no power = wisdom to do so and well eat them?

You are to ..if you are to resolve you life and and you families lives in a righteous relationship  ....free to test the spirits and judge those aspect of how these men and women do what the do in character reguarleess of their personilities and learning = knowedge and to do that  you should have their time ( patiences) as much as they ask for yours, to Know them!  If  they don't have it = time ( to keep their word)  there is your test.

You see being in character is the power of time , in that you relate to He who has it in HIs hands.

In the Kingdom way, as it is founded on righteousness, we have time to make time, therefore redeem time , because when you are functioing out of love as opposed to fear =  you are doing Gods will in creating time for Him.

This eleminates the fear "If you had just been her all would no have gone wrong!" ... question?

IN... principle all things respond to time via its own structure manifested in it's being what  or who it is character in how it takes it time to doing what it does to function= an approch.

A false prophet to the degree he or she has time , to take time is for themselves, because they have no character, and in this like of likeness we see very easly into this like of character , because they must act like they Know you and in turth they do not and in principle do not know the King.

Its a buddie , buddie thing, manifeested in the ideal I'll be your friend as long as you do what I do to get attentions in my attentding to what I think is Right.

Folks ask me all the time.... if I have time..... and I say yes, based on their own needs. My time used to be mine, when I was doing (own my owm) ministery and now that I am in  God's ( in Character)  time, the question of how is it , if I give this time do I have time to make money or a living. ( you know giving all my time away), but in the Kingdom , I am working and it not my time , it's Our Lords. This is a matter of an election and why true prophets are no given to being paid via a ministery of give to sell products to make ends meet.

Thanks Bro. Larry

Posted: 09/23/2008 at 11:59am | IP Logged

This is excellent Larry,

Just in looking at Jesus in His earthly ministry, He had given of Himself to `sit down'. He was first and foremost relational as a Son, being the Son of His Father. Being the Son of His Father, He related in such way( righteousness) that was calling all who heard into the same. That being, sons of God. As His sons and daughters, we relate the same. Brother to brother, sister to sister, ect., first and foremost and not by way of gifting only.

To esteem a gift above that of being a son/daughter, will become evident as His character is lacking. That doesn't neccesarily make one `false' as we may have a certain mindset of what is, but it does show or make evident a lack of walking in righteousness( right-relating, right relationship). So, there is a taking down within the soul that which exalts itself against the knowledge of God. Those `things' which are not yet reconciled within the soul, to His thoughts producing ways. In this I'm simply sharing making our calling, our election sure, maturing sons and daughters of God our Father, manifesting His character which is that of our Elder Brother Jesus.

I've had to do various things even as I am responding here( which happens alot lol) which requires my time, my attention. Some may look at it as being interrupted or interruptions but it is not, as it comes from being in relationship with family and those here who He has added, however long.

In defining the true from the false, we need look at the Son and the character of the Father from Whom He came and made known. The wolves in sheep clothing will have no relationship but as you shared here Larry, but too devour and to make themselves fat. They dishonor His Name, esteem themself and seek after gain. If one looks deep enough( for lack of better wording), the love of money is the root of evil from which they move among. 

 Larry wrote, "In the Kingdom way, as it is founded on righteousness, we have time to make time, therefore redeem time , because when you are functioing out of love as opposed to fear"

yes, His Love is the Kingdom way( Highway called holiness) which fulfills all righteousnes.

whoops! had to make an edit: I had written -The sheeps in wolves clothing. corrected that :))

Posted: 09/23/2008 at 5:02pm | IP Logged

Thank You, You have truly done your homework! Bro. Bojo Sun

Much Love In Christ

Charlotte Carroll

Posted: 09/23/2008 at 8:36pm | IP Logged

Thanks, everyone for your response.

Dear Larry, hope you are doing good. (Have you shared my receipt with Bonnie? I am curious of what she will make of it.)

Dear Kathy, it is alway wonderful to have you share with us.

Dear Charlotte, I deeply appreciate your encouragement; I think I am much humbled by what the Lord is revealing to others even here. I have to confess that I have not done a good job with my homework-much to learn and much to grow for me.

Larry mentioned the concept of righteousness of God being granted through our patience in Him and with one another. It is truly hard to have genuine fellowship in the midst of a fast-paced life style and commercialized culture, where patience in the Lord and with one another are treated wtih comtempt.

I can only hope that God will bless me with hearing ears and a softened heart, as I have to "fight" my way through my jungles, wilderness, even a steep path to the mountain top.

Yet we have a sure hope. Every ragged mountain will tumble and be shaken, but God's Holy Mountian will be exalted above them all. Let's strengthen the weak, comfort one another and follow the King to journey on.

Even so, I believer brother Terry's writing is much needed and very practical, of which I myself deeply appreciate.

Posted: 10/06/2008 at 5:33pm | IP Logged

very excellent Larry

I met pastor in the Church. I ask him question about Bible.

he is really have the Love of God and mind of Christ in him. God bless him.

God bless you.

Posted: 10/12/2008 at 5:26pm | IP Logged

Thanks to all here!

I am a bit late , but wanted to share a thought via Tina nd Katheys thoughts as they both reflect very deep things in spirit. I speak of feeling here and it is not easy to share what one feels, so as to make other see ,,,, nevertheless I believe Our Lord would have us turn to Him for understaniding and in His character we are assured of the Holy Spirits ability to teach what is a matter of sin in the that if contrast a righteous way to judgement.

Tina shares...

The sobering reality is that He very well may send a very serious directive word to the body of Christ through one or more of His prophets that everyone has judged to be totally false and or in serious error in one or more areas of their lives, which will then cause that directive to go unheeded.  To what degree of disaster might that then entail?

While we all strive to be the best we can be for the Lord and to His body we simply have to stop coming up with a step by step syllabus that outlines how a prophet 'should look and act and have his being'.   That is the Lord's to do. 

I agree as this is not even found in the Word of God, but we in principle we are to look into the matter. How we do this is in Spirit and if manifested in an up front and close realtionship whith folks responding to their calling and election to study the matter , we must come to the wisdom of judging the matter as a matter.

(((Note: Ispeak of doing this right where you are in your day today felwoship as it is a bit hard to do this via post or letters , but it is still there!)))

 Mattter = A subject of concern, feeling, or action: matters of foreign policy; a personal matter.

So, our judgement must be a matter of righteous judgement, lesst it be foever presented as a matter of intelect as the expence of never judging at all.

Here on this site it seems good to me to work on these things, but what is more important is to obey Our Lord direction vai His correction on the matter and that is to be conscious in our realtionships with one another that who this person is Who is looking into these things is not the matter is important ,but more so but How he or she does it is. = that is what is to be judged!

Righteous judgement call for us to respond in Character to the like of character in the how one is proceeding to do anything to teach you what they think is good , in order to have you resopnd in a good way, in which they are not able to "use': so as to love you, cannot love thenselves.

((("I think Bojo can help us here on how one could state this!)))

That a bit deep but ok, we need to see if I have the patience to come back and set with those to answer the deepness our knowledge and if I cannot honor you time as you have honor my time... I would hope you could see right through the sheeps clothing  to see the teeth!

Am I a false prophet? I need to be tested, in spirit to see if there are other prophets who desire to resolve themselves in spirit as comapred to the flesh, and unlike Bojo who is readly ready to work on the matter , run when you get do never taking time  to honor your asking asking them just where is they find their understanding in the Word of God .

In principle I do not judge myself on how much I know , but is how I bear the burden of being found  in the character of Our Lord as I share with others.

Kathey tell us:

I've had to do various things even as I am responding here( which happens alot lol) which requires my time, my attention. Some may look at it as being interrupted or interruptions but it is not, as it comes from being in relationship with family and those here who He has added, however long.

If I feel this word correctly it is a matter of righteous judgement. Meaning we all come short of being able to convey our understanding , never the less we stay put in character to love in character = being who we are in Our Lord Name, reguardless of our understanding.

In truth children do this better , until the grow up in fear, but in our being if we remain in character with them , they get it! It only when we try to do our thing to sway their doing be having them evaluate our great intellect ( smarts) as folks given to fleshly wisdom do and never set with those we love... that they never learn What matters, because they never no When it matters, leading to never knowing How it matters.

Again If I get it... Kathey does and in principle cannot , even as we cannot convey all that  we know, but we can convey our love manifested by and found  in our patience and kindness with one another , there by allowing "ALL" to learn... However long

To learn Law yes, but more so His Grace, which if understood can be applied as Mercy!

My mercy, not Our Lords Mercy

Did I lean the meaning of the following scripture as a child by some great Sunday School teacher?  Nope. learned it for my Grannie, as it was manifested in those tasty fruit of kindness and patience with me... in correcting me on my ability to do mean things to my old hound dog, while he endured all of it... with you know ...with patiences.

Proverbs 3:3 (KJV) 
    Let not mercy and truth forsake thee: bind them about thy neck; write them upon the table of thine heart:

Proverbs 14:21-22 (KJV) 
    He that despiseth his neighbour sinneth: but he that hath mercy on the poor, happy is he.  Do they not err that devise evil? but mercy and truth shall be to them that devise good.

Proverbs 14:31 (KJV) 
    He that oppresseth the poor reproacheth his Maker: but he that honoureth him hath mercy on the poor.

Proverbs 16:6 (KJV) 
    By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the Lord men depart from evil.

Proverbs 20:28 (KJV) 
    Mercy and truth preserve the king: and his throne is upholden by mercy.

It is hard to set with men as they project what they have understood as a principle they want to apply when they have no mercy in doing so! Never- the- less Our  Lord, Who is Christ ... requires His servant to do so manifesting His Mercy in telling these same what they think is a matter of principle/truth is nothing but an ideal projected by their peers to be accepted into unrighteorus approace to loving folks the way the world does... making the matter false.

Bro Larry

Posted: 10/12/2008 at 6:53pm | IP Logged

 Whoops you forgot one very important verse that many pastors dismiss ?!

1 Corinthians 14:32 (New King James Version)