Posted: 02/07/2009 at 9:25pm | IP Logged

Strategic Messengers concerning “Next Things”
I saw in a vision two orders of angels standing, encircling the congregation of the Lord.  There were warring angels, watchfully alert, ready to guard and protect.  And there were others that carried scrolls in their hands.  I asked the Lord what these angels were.  He said, “These are messenger angels, which bring strategies of  “Next Things”.   I asked the Lord, “Why are the messenger angels idle”?   Immediately the scene changed and I saw the faces of the people, even leaders, turned toward each other, striving and quarreling.  

Thoughts on this vision

·         Strife is the great destroyer of fellowship and covenant with one another

·         Striving with one another blocks our ability to hear from the Lord

·         The Father is willing to release strategies that inform, equip, and empower us to handle “Next Things”

·         We are not waiting on heaven

·         Angelic messengers are in place to discharge  this heavenly insight  

·         Heaven is waiting on us!

·         Internal conflict with each other in the body of Christ has destroyed our ability to focus on the Lord

·         In order to receive we must resolve our issues with each other and turn our  minds and hearts to Him

·         Only then will we receive the stratagem needed to deal with and cope with future things

I Love You Church,
Bro Cleve

clevesharp.com

Posted: 02/07/2009 at 11:47pm | IP Logged

 Yes Overcome ! This is not a game !

 To him who overcomes . . .

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 8:07am | IP Logged

For me, I have a sense of caution concerning this "word."  True Spiritual unity is certainly something to be desired.  However, in our zeal for that unity, we must not trespass into what amounts to ecumenism.  We must not cast off discernment for the sake of a well-intended unity put together by the flesh. 

As one man has said, "It is better to be divided by truth than united in error.  When Jesus prayed, "Father, I pray that they might be one as we are one."  The operative phrase is, "as we are one."  It would serve us well to ponder that phrase and digest its meaning.

Fred

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 9:04am | IP Logged

Cleve i witness the truth to what you wrote.. Much depth and truth in them..

Fred, im concerned with the pattern i see of you trying to add to peoples words. The words u suggest are in no way implied at all..

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 10:35am | IP Logged

Richard,

It is not what you describe as "implied" that concerns me but rather what is literally expressed.  In fact, I purposely limited my remarks to that which I considered appropriate to an initial response.  My chief concern is related to the ramifications of such a "word," as well as the substance of the "word" itself.  I believe in prophetic words and I certainly believe in the existence of angels and that they have certain God-ordained functions,. But, Paul is very explicit when he writes to the Colosians and the Galatians that we must be expecially discerning when it comes to messages given through angelic messengers, or what may appear to be angelic messengers, or eactions related to angels. 

Judging words and adding to words, as you suggest, are two entirely different approaches.  You have every right to accept this "word" or any other "word" you choose.  That is your prerogative.  For me, I not only have the right, but the Scriptural responsibility, to judge prophetic words.  Some, I bear witness to and some I don't in light of Scripture and the confirmation of the Spirit.  But, regardless of the outcome,  I apply the same process of discernment for one  as I do for all.  My standard of measure is the Scriptures and the bearing witness of the Holy Spirit, whether it be of "men or of angels." 

Also, you may want to consider one other factor as it relates to the "pattern" you say you observe in me.  Consider that this "pattern" may have less to do with me and more to do with the ever increasing pattern of the type of "prophetic words" so commonplace, even popular, in our day.  This directly refers back to my thread concerning "Prophetic Words and Accountability."  Therefore, it is incumbent upon us to be faithful to Paul's admonition, "..... holding fast the faithful word which is in accordance with the teaching, that he may be able to exhort in sound doctrine, and to refute those who contradict" (Titus 1:9).

Fred

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 12:53pm | IP Logged

Fred there was a huge addition you made to this posts, and several others. What was the message of the pharisees in the day of Christ? Our message is right, everyone elses is wrong. Last Year this is what the LORD spoke to me regarding those who "divine"... Those who go around calling every word false, every person but themselves false points out their own false character..

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 2:39pm | IP Logged

Richard,

Per your words. and not mine, either I am a true watchman of God or a false prophet and a liar.  I cannot be both.  Moreover, for someone who is not remotely acquainted with me, this is quite an accusation and blatant character assassination, which is something I have not engaged in.  That said, I do not take your comments personally as I have been around too long for that.  But, as with my approach and attitude towards this prophetic word, since you have chosen to raise this character issue, it is for you to come to grips with this seeming contradiction.  God forbid that the issue should be about me.  It's not about me, but rather about a more accurate representation of Christ, of God's purposes and ways.  "All" is just that, an all inclusive term and you state that "all" you have ever read from me is negative.  Apparently, you have skipped over some of my comments on various threads.

Now, pertaining to this particular thread, nowhere did I attack Cleve Sharp or call into question his character.  I restricted my comments squarely on the substance of the prophetic word itself, and nothing more.  I expect nothing less from those who read my writings, some of which have a more prophetic emphasis.  When I post something in a public forum, I accept the reality of having my words scrutinized (tested and examined) by the reader and have absolutely no problem with that.  In fact, per the Scriptures, they have every right and obligation to do so.  A true man of integrity should even welcome it.

Fred

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 6:08pm | IP Logged

Richard,

To this point, I have endeavored to be gracious in my replies to you, but if this is your idea of blessing me, I would suggest you not waste it on me, or anyone else, for that matter.  It is what one might call, "a left-handed blessing."  I am not so naive as to believe that your expressed hope in "seeing my gifting mature," rather than being offerred in an attitude of genuine concern, was a rather uncomely way of taking a cheap shot at me. 

But, it is quite easy, and I dare say, cowardly, to make such statements from a distance and in relative annonymity.  I would also exhort you not to be so presumptuous in denegrating my, or anyone else's, level of maturity.  Though I readily acknowledge that there is yet much for me to learn in Christ and in obtaining a fuller revelation of Himself and God's purposes and ways, I am by no means a youth, either spiritually or naturally.    

Furthermore, since you have taken it upon yourself to engage me in a dispute which has nothing to do with the essense of the word itself, there is very little to discuss with you.  Your rebuttal, if one can call it that, is filled with personal aspersions, accusations, and name calling.  Shame on you!  A mature man of God should be above that amidst reasonable and civil discussion.  There is a place for honest dissent as depicted throughout Scripture, and it is unfortunate that you have not found that place as yet.  At the same time you have failed to address the veracity of this "word," and neither have you addressed the legitimate questions I have raised pertaining to this "word." 

Just because you believe this man, or any other, to be a prophet, does not make it so, and neither does your believing a "word" to be a "prophetic word" necessarily make it so, either.  That same principle applies to to all others, myself included, as well.  No one,except the Lord Jesus Himself and His heavenly Father is above accountability, that is, unless you happen to believe in the infallability of the Pope. 

If your idea of Scriptural discernment, examination, and raising questions as to clarification, application, and interpretation according to sound doctrine, is somehow the equivalent of "adding or taking away" from a "prophetic word," then you are on shakier ground than even the false prophets and false prophecies, themselves. 

Fred

.  

Posted: 02/08/2009 at 9:33pm | IP Logged

Cleve Sharp wrote: Can we walk in unity and yet diversity?  Yes     Can we contend without being contentious?  Yes Can we love without agreeing on every issue?  Yes

Yes : )

Posted: 02/09/2009 at 7:40am | IP Logged

Cleve,  

Yes ,  amen, a beautiful picture of the angels waiting to disperse the Word given at specfic times, thru the body. How can the word be effective?  It has to be spoken out, thru the (body of Christ)..  then it will go into the earth, and bring forth fruit for the advancement of the KINGDOM OF GOD>>>  Yes, the body needs to keep in line, and not get out of place, but to be where each individual needs to be, listening to the Commander in Chief, of the Heavenly realms..  Commander Jesus..   the Man of War...   the Man of Peace..  the Everlasting to Everlasting..  Amen...

Rose

Posted: 02/09/2009 at 8:16am | IP Logged

Cleve,

I can appreciate your comments and concerns, and I believe your response to these exchanges is admirably gracious.  My primary motive is not to win an argument, but rather to lay out the issues, concerns, and Biblical principles and process, in the hopes that others may read, learn, and discern for themselves.  I am well aware that Proverbs teaches that "any fool can argue."  But, as stated previously, that is not my ultimate objective in this exercise.

Regardless, since you are the author of this thread, out of respect for you, I will defer to your wishes, believing that the prudent thing to do at this point is to bow out of this discussion.  I believe I have sufficiently brought to light what I felt necessary, and I shall leave it at that.

Hopefully, you will recognize that though I may have questioned the essense of the prophetic word (vision) that you submitted, I never questioned your character or integrity.  Not being familar with you, that would be quite presumptuous and unfair on my part.

Once again, I appreciate your thoughts and the graciousness with which you expressed them.

Fred  

Posted: 02/09/2009 at 9:55am | IP Logged

To Guard and Protect.

These are some of the things that I saw in the vision ...

"Why are the messenger angles Idle?"

I beleive the vision is literal but shown in parable form. There are three elements in the vision.

1.) The congregation of the Lord.

2.) The warring angels.

3.) The messenger angels.

There was one order of angels that were active - the warring angels.

The other order was idle - the messenger angels.

The two orders of angels are meant to work together in unison.

But if the congregation of the Lord is not in unity - the message, the vision of direction is confused. When the congregation is in unity the warring angels are released to guard and protect. The correct vision-direction for the congregation comes through realizing that direction must have a corporate application. It comes as an edification of the body.

These "Next Things" must be in that context. To edify and build up.

Within a unified body there is protection and a gaurding - thus releasing the first order of angels.

In that sense heaven waits on US.

Posted: 02/09/2009 at 1:57pm | IP Logged

"We are all one and our words from the Lord that we receive as individuals are meant to bring an equalization - an acceptence for one another- there is not a spirit of competition or individualism (for example - 'Who is allowed to sit at thy right hand Lord?' )  in the words received from Him."  

Posted: 02/11/2009 at 9:19am | IP Logged

³About the ninth hour of the day he saw clearly in a vision an angel of God coming in and saying to him, “Cornelius!”

⁴And when he observed him, he was afraid, and said, “What is it, lord?”

So he said to him, “Your prayers and your alms have come up for a memorial before God. ⁵Now send men to Joppa, and send for Simon whose surname is Peter. ⁶He is lodging with Simon, a tanner, whose house is by the sea. He will tell you what you must do.” ⁷And when the angel who spoke to him had departed

I don't believe these things are common as far as the visual part.  However, I do believe this happens in the unseen realm all the time.  My small son asked me one time, "Who is that one that stands by your shoulder when you are speaking dad?  I said, "What do you mean son".  He said, "There is a big guy that stands by you and every time you hesitate he leans over and whispers to you."  Of course I've not seen this one but I believe that with my commission there are those the Father has attached to my assignment.  I also believe the condition of my heart hinders or enables the release of the information I need. Just as the prayers of married couples are hinder because of strife I believe this happens in the body all the time. 

It occurs to me that some may think that I am trying to take away from the leadership of the Holy Ghost.  I am in no way touching the precious work, leadership, direction, and insight that comes through the Holy Ghost.

Thank you Father for giving us the Holy Ghost!!!

Blessings Vicki,

Bro Cleve

clevesharp.com

Posted: 02/12/2009 at 8:01am | IP Logged

I recieve the vision and the Spirit of the word given.

Kris

Posted: 02/13/2009 at 10:41pm | IP Logged

Brother our God is an on time God!  Be encouraged.  Don't get weary in well doing for in due season you shall reap a reward.  God is going to lift you up and the glory will be seen in you in a mighty way.  God is doing a new thing in you and all will be amazed!  God trusts you and deeper revelation He will give to you.  God bless you.

Posted: 02/15/2009 at 6:39pm | IP Logged

 Cleve !

 Good word my brother and so timely as we sit and listen for strategy , perhaps this word will ring in some understanding . . .

 Border patrols ( watchmen ) are enforcing and reinforcing My boundaries ( standards ) I have set up against the enemies resistance trying to cause entanglements ( confusion ) , so be at rest by inquiring of Me as David did !

Posted: 02/17/2009 at 3:31pm | IP Logged

Grace and peace  be multiplyed unto you beloved Bride of Christ

Malachi 3:1  behold, I will send my messenger, and he will prepare the way before Me. And the Lord whom you seek Will suddenly come to His temple, Even the messenger of the COVENANT, In whom you delight. Behold, He is coming," says the Lord of the hosts. 

IN THE LIVING OIL...................................Zachary