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VOICE OF PROPHECY - Prophetic Words
OpenHeaven.com Forum : VOICE OF PROPHECY - Prophetic Words
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Ron McGatlin
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Posted: 11/19/2008 at 5:56am | IP Logged Quote Ron McGatlin

Organic Organization
By Ron McGatlin
Much is being said and written today regarding the major shifting and change that is occurring in church organizations, systems, and structure. For almost two millennia the function of apostle has been considered non-existent. In recent centuries, the term apostle and apostolic has been considered archaic and of little or no significance except in referring to the first century Apostles of the Lamb.
In the first part of the twentieth century, the works of the Holy Spirit that originally came forth two thousand years ago at Pentecost were restored and began to transform much of the church. In the later part of the twentieth century, the Holy Spirit began to reveal the reality of the gospel of the kingdom. The revelation of the kingdom of God coming forth on earth within Godís people by the Holy Spirit forming the life of Christ Jesus in believers led to the beginning of the restoration of the functioning apostle and apostolic ministry.
Absolutely none of the restoration of the works of the Holy Spirit or the revelation of the gospel of the kingdom has been engineered by man. This has been and continues to be the work of God through the Holy Spirit. Yes, the works of the Spirit of God are often attacked, mimicked, and merchandised by the manipulation of foolish men, but the restoration of the works of the Spirit, including the revelation of the gospel of the kingdom, is purely a work of the Spirit and not of the minds of men.
The passing church systems and organizational structures were developed by the works of men without the full work of the Holy Spirit. They were the engineering of men not the creation of God through His Spirit. Yes, God has worked as much as possible through these man-made systems because of the multitudes of people who have sought to serve God faithfully within the systems.
The restoration of apostles and apostolic function must flow purely from Christ Jesus the Great Apostle through the Spirit of God: the government of the ekklesia and eventually the world is Christ Jesus who is the only Head of the ekklesia. Apostles do not represent Christ and do not receive special delegated authority from Christ. They are filled with Christ by the Holy Spirit, and Christ in them flows to do the work they are given to do. Christ lives in all people who are filled with the Sprit of God Ė those who are submerged into the Holy Spirit of God and are no longer living their own life but the life they live is Christ.
This stuff is real, or it is not real. And if it is not real, we are sadly misled in seeking to follow great error from the Bible.
The government of God by the Spirit of Christ in the people
Ekklesia is the Greek word translated church in the New Testament. It does not have exactly the same meaning as the English word ecclesia or ecclesiastic or ecclesiastical which are words pertaining to the religious order and clergy or clerical systems of the man-made church order. Ekklesia, ek-klay-see'-ah basically means a called-out gathering.
The foundational fathering quality of the gift of apostle is from Christ within by the Spirit. The speaking of spiritual truth, the gift of prophet is from Christ within by the Spirit. The gathering gift of the evangelist is from Christ within by the Spirit. The shepherd gift of the pastor and the instructional gift of the teacher are from Christ within by the Spirit. These gifts are all of Christ and flow by the Holy Spirit to build up the people to the measure of the full stature of Christ.
These gifted men are often mistakenly seen as offices of authority and control. This is a carryover of the priestly clerical order from the passing man-made church systems. This erroneous concept should not be mixed in or reproduced in the kingdom of God on earth from heaven.
I know some of this may be very difficult for many reading this to consider; real change is rarely easy. But consider carefully by the Spirit and the word, the works of Christ in His people by the Holy Spirit of God.
For understanding purposes we need to separate the gift and the man. These gifts are not forever, but Godís people are forever. The gifts are what they are from beginning to end. However, people begin in immaturity and grow into maturity. While the person is yet immature the gifts may be restrained by the Spirit and more fully released as the person is matured in the Spirit. Spiritual maturity can be boiled down to the practical reality of the death of the old self-life and the life of Christ Jesus abiding in its place. It is Christ fully living within by the Holy Spirit of God.
A biblical word for a mature person is elder. The spiritually mature are elders. Elders are leaders of the younger or less mature. Elders may or may not be gifted as apostle, prophet, evangelist, shepherd, or teacher. They are not over a group or gathering but are among a group or gathering. Elders (the spiritually mature) are leaders. The gifts are not leaders, they are tools given to elders (leaders). Elders with gifts are not set above others. All are of Christ Jesus and are as vessels emptied of self-life and filled with the life of Christ Jesus by the Holy Spirit of God. Elders are respected by ďyoungersĒ who are led by the Spirit to readily submit to the leadership of Christ Jesus in their elder brothers as they mature thereby.
Godís natural created order
None of this is structured by man. If our minds begin to envision levels or offices of organizational structure, we are thinking in the old mindset of man-made church. This whole thing is led by Christ Jesus through the Holy Spirit and develops in a spiritual pattern unique to each group, city, or geographic location.
Everything of Godís creation has a natural or created order. That order is what makes it to be what it is. God uses the same basic elements to form many different things. It is the spiritual order or Godís design that produces the many distinct created things that we call natural. The word ďorganicĒ by recent usage has come to indicate that something is of Godís natural designed order and not re-ordered or genetically engineered by man.
Godís organic creation does not make exact duplicate reproductions. The leaves on a species of tree all look the same at a casual look. But upon close examination no two leaves are exactly the same. I am told that no two snow flakes have been found to be exactly the same when viewed through a microscope. All human beings have similar characteristics: two eyes, two ears, one mouth, one nose, and so on. Yet no two people are exactly the same; even identical twins will have some unique distinctions. It is manís idea to make religious cookie cutter engineered machinery and products instead of Godís organic ekklesia.
Holy Spirit guidance and networking
In this moment of time we have the greatest technical networking tools ever available to any people on earth in all history. The internet and the cell phone allow us to connect instantly worldwide. If we are truly led of the Spirit, we have instant spiritual/natural networking. Did God design these things for the building up of the kingdom of God? Instantly and inexpensively the voice of God can be amplified across the world in seconds, if we speak with the voice of God by the Spirit. Yet, if we are not fully led of the Spirit, it is only natural human connecting.
Consider the apostolic networking and guidance of the Holy Sprit when Peter was in Joppa in a spiritual trance and saw a vision and heard a voice and was given instruction. Instantly men were at the gate and asked him to come with them. He already knew from the Holy Spirit speaking to him to go with them. Cornelius who was not yet able to hear from the Spirit had an angel appear to him and tell him to send for Peter to hear from Him. This is spiritual natural networking and guidance. The Spirit spoke on both ends and the natural people went to Peter; and the connection was made and the work accomplished. (Acts 10:10-23)
Consider how Paul and Timothy were guided by the Holy Spirit through their journey.
Acts 16:6-10: Now when they had gone through Phrygia and the region of Galatia, they were forbidden by the Holy Spirit to preach the word in Asia. After they had come to Mysia, they tried to go into Bithynia, but the Spirit did not permit them. So passing by Mysia, they came down to Troas. And a vision appeared to Paul in the night. A man of Macedonia stood and pleaded with him, saying, "Come over to Macedonia and help us." Now after he had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go to Macedonia, concluding that the Lord had called us to preach the gospel to them.
The New Testament if full of examples of the apostles being led by the Holy Spirit and interacting together in the Spirit. They often received correction and direction on the spot while moving in the apostolic works flowing through them.
This is how apostolic networks come together and how they must function: always fully led by the Spirit whether there is an available internet or cell phone or air planes or not. Networking and connections must be by the Holy Spirit and subject to intervention and redirection of God by the Holy Spirit at any moment.
Keep on pursuing love.
It never fails.

Ron McGatlin
Coordinator OpenHeaven.com

archive.openheaven.com
basileia@earthlink.net


Edited by Ron McGatlin on 06/02/2010 at 6:00pm
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Dave Spencer
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Posted: 11/19/2008 at 9:07am | IP Logged Quote Dave Spencer


Ron,

Yes, I agree that if we would just separate the person from the gifting, many more of us would fully enter into the kingdom of God.  Some of the people with "structural giftings" can seem like they ought to have positions of man-made authority in order to function properly, but this isn't entirely true.  For example, Paul said that he was considered by some of those in the church to be of little esteem.  That is, he did not push his way to the top-center positionally.  He just functioned as an elder church-planter and then moved on and became an adviser, like a parent of grown children should do.  But he did this in the context of our oneness in Christ, so he still retained his spiritual authority within the churches he planted through the gifts given to build the kingdom of God.

"I am told that no two snow flakes are exactly the same when viewed through a microscope."

Probally not true.  The number of snowflakes that have fallen since the beginning of time approaches infinity.  Therefore, the possibility of two matching is very likely.  However, if one limits the task to comparing only snowflakes to those that have fallen in the same snow storm, then the statement is most likely true.  The reason I mention this is that it sounds very much like some of the debates we get into in church!  When we take a kingdom viewpoint (nearing infinity), we come to one conclusion, but when we take the local-event viewpoint, we reach another.

With His Love,
Dave




Edited by Dave Spencer on 11/19/2008 at 10:01am
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Posted: 11/19/2008 at 2:20pm | IP Logged Quote Ron McGatlin

Hello Dave,

Thanks for the reply. Very good point about the snow flakes. I have changed that sentence to read: "I am told that no two snow flakes have been found to be exactly the same when viewed through a microscope."

Ron

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Posted: 11/19/2008 at 4:34pm | IP Logged Quote Pat Huff

I just got finished expressing some doubts about the spirit-filled life in another post and after reading this and being a little more clear as a result, I would like to revise or erase it but I guess the rules don't permit that. I was then, of course, thinking in terms of the cookie cutter, mechanistic religious institution rather than the organic ecclesia. Thanks, Ron for your insightful article. I especially liked "A Different America" and have emailed it around. I still read it often and weep.
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Posted: 11/19/2008 at 8:28pm | IP Logged Quote Dave Spencer


Hi, Pat.

You can edit a post by using the "edit" button at the bottom of your post and deleting/changing whatever you want to delete/change.  If you want to remove everything, just delete it all and put in a phrase like "Content removed by poster" or some other appropriate statement.  Many of us on OH have done this at some time or other.

You have at least one quality that I admire: the ability to reason, listen to the Holy Spirit, learn, and then revise your opinion!

May God bless you!

Dave



Edited by Dave Spencer on 11/19/2008 at 8:39pm
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Posted: 11/20/2008 at 7:47pm | IP Logged Quote Ron McGatlin

Thanks Pat for your reply. God is moving us all to a fresh and new place of reality in Christ Jesus by the Holy Spirit. Yes, we are in a quite different American from the one we more mature folks grew up in. And surely it will get darker before morning. However, the bright light of the kingdom of God on earth as it is in heaven is ahead on the other side of the dark storm cloudes. Great darkness shall cover the earth but the glory of the Lord shal arise upon the people of God.

Isa 60:1-2:  Arise, shine; For your light has come! And the glory of the LORD is risen upon you.  For behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, And deep darkness the people; But the LORD will arise over you, And His glory will be seen upon you.

Ron

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Posted: 11/21/2008 at 2:37am | IP Logged Quote Mandy Gay

Ron wrote:

Isa 60:1-2:  Arise, shine; For your light has come! And the glory of the LORD is risen upon you.  For behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, And deep darkness the people; But the LORD will arise over you, And His glory will be seen upon you.

Last night as I was seeking to get a hold of the reality of God's grace in a difficult time I'm facing, I had a vision where rain was falling but the people were covered by black umbrellas.  It reminded me of the scenes I've seen on tv where the city workers are all moving along in one direction on their way to work covered by a mass of black umbrellas.  It looks so heavy and dark.

But in the vision, the feeling above the mass of black umbrellas was good.  It represented God's glory and His grace showering down.  But the people couldn't enjoy it because the umbrellas were in the way.

It makes me think of the old testament story where the servant only saw the enemies surrounding them, but the prophet saw the much greater army of the Lord surrounding them.

Do we see the darkness, or do we see the light, which is far greater?  Once I decided to focus on what's above the black umbrellas (which represents discouraging lies to me), then I was able to receive His grace into my situation.

Isa 60:1-2:  Arise, shine; For your light has come! And the glory of the LORD is risen upon you.  For behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, And deep darkness the people; But the LORD will arise over you, And His glory will be seen upon you. (emphasis mine)

The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

It's all a matter of perspective.

Love Mandy



Edited by Mandy Gay on 11/21/2008 at 2:43am
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Posted: 11/21/2008 at 1:15pm | IP Logged Quote Ron McGatlin

Umbrellas of darkness blotting out the light of His glory, Amen Mandy. The layer of darkness and those yet under or within it is indeed very great but the light of His glorious kingdom is greater. When the light of His kingdom is seen by someone in the darkness of sin and false religions, the person has the choice to move toward the light and receive the light. However, many love the darkness and will turn away from the light and back into the darkness. Others will move toward the light and receive the light and be translated from the kingdom of darkness into the light of the kingdom of God's Son.

John 3:19-21:  "And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. "For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. "But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God."

Col 1:913:  For this reason we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding that you may walk worthy of the Lord, fully pleasing Him, being fruitful in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God; strengthened with all might, according to His glorious power, for all patience and longsuffering with joy; giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light. He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love,

Ron

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Posted: 11/24/2008 at 4:55am | IP Logged Quote Ron McGatlin

Led by the Spirit - Walk in the Spirit

Consider how Paul and Timothy were guided by the Holy Spirit through their journey.
Acts 16:6-10: Now when they had gone through Phrygia and the region of Galatia, they were forbidden by the Holy Spirit to preach the word in Asia. After they had come to Mysia, they tried to go into Bithynia, but the Spirit did not permit them. So passing by Mysia, they came down to Troas. And a vision appeared to Paul in the night. A man of Macedonia stood and pleaded with him, saying, "Come over to Macedonia and help us." Now after he had seen the vision, immediately we sought to go to Macedonia, concluding that the Lord had called us to preach the gospel to them.
The New Testament if full of examples of the apostles being led by the Holy Spirit and interacting together in the Spirit. They often received correction and direction on the spot while moving in the apostolic works flowing through them.
This is how apostolic networks come together and how they must function: always fully led by the Spirit whether there is an available internet or cell phone or air planes or not. Networking and connections must be by the Holy Spirit and subject to intervention and redirection of God by the Holy Spirit at any moment.
Ron
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